Tuesday, November 8, 2011

Care Sheet: Lasiodora parahybana - Salmon Pink Birdeater




Care Sheet:  Lasiodora parahybana - Salmon Pink Birdeater


Before being concerned about specific humidity/temperature gauges, I would highly suggest having a look at this book: http://books.google.com/books?id=rIVAkA3IlHgC&printsec=frontcover&source=gbs_ge_summary_r&cad=0#v=onepage&q&f=false
or possibly even purchasing it, as it has tons of information that clear’s up a lot of confusion as to these little creatures. There is a lot of false marketing and false opinions out there and the information represented here is meant as a guideline and not a specific rule that can be applied to all of these types of tarantulas. There are variations even in the same species! The goal of the information here is to get an in depth view on the tarantula from an owner/handlers eyes.

Common Name: Salmon Pink Birdeater         
Scientific Name: Lasiodora parahybana
Origin: Brazil
Type: New World Terrestrial
Temperature: 20-30 °C (remember this range is a guideline)
Humidity: 65-85% (remember this range is a guideline)
                 
Max Size: approx. 10"-12” (remember this range is a guideline)
Speed: Slow (remember this is a guideline)
Temperament: Tolerant but moody (remember this is a guideline)
Venom: Mild
Growth Rate: Ultra Fast (remember this is a guideline)

Description:

The top 3 largest tarantulas in the world are L. parahybana T. blondi and T. apophysis, adult male L. parahybana’s can reach epic leg spans of 11 inches+. Most people are intensely frightened by this sheer size possibility, coupled with a Hollywood induced phobia, but this is completely uncalled for. These tarantulas don’t charge you on sight to rip out a jugular, actually quite the opposite! They can be successfully handled if given the due respect and a person is aware of their warning signs if they are not in the mood. Velvety black all over, but with bright pink hairs covering nearly all of their bodies, these tarantulas are awesome display animals and choose to sit out in the open the majority of the time. This might be because their massive size gives them a sense of confidence not present in most tarantulas.

Housing:

L. parahybana love taking walks in their tank, thus they benefit from a larger tank which also helps due to the fact that they are so large combined with the fact that they grow extremely fast (growth from 1” to 6” in a year is VERY possible).  I have found that my L. parahybana enjoys different ‘textured’ surfaces to climb on and play around from any bark/wood section to a smooth pebble etc. At some stage in it’s adult life this species could require a medium to large fish tank as its home. A hide is not a necessity, but is always helpful in reducing any stress the animal ever experiences. The tanks should NOT be more than the tarantulas leg span x 2 (5cm leg span = 10cm max height on the tank) as a fall from this bulky species could cause an injury and death. Also avoid any sharp edged decorations in the tank.

Temperatures should be around 25 °C, with humidity Ok at around 75%. A large water bowl is fine, and will be used often.

Feeding:

L. parahybana’s are reminiscent of living trash compactors. They eat and eat and eat and eat and eat and then eat some more, and will tackle any prey of pretty much any size. They do need to eat more than most, to sustain their epic growth rate, which is amongst the fastest of any tarantula anywhere. I have found that feeding them two crickets twice a week is similar to power feeding, which I will only do until they reach between a quarter and a third of their adult size (this rule can be applied to all T’s) then I will drop down to one cricket twice a week. However, although they would LIKE to eat all day long, one large cockroach every 2 weeks is more than enough. This species, due to its sheer size, will actually benefit from eating a pinky every once or twice a month.

Temperament:

General: These tarantulas at a small size sometimes do have short bursts to move away from disturbances, but if handled correctly are actually quite gentle giants. They don’t like being moved very much and as such you shouldn’t chase them around the tank trying to get them onto your hand. Rather leave them for 10-15min and then maybe try again. I have had mine flick hairs at me once or twice when changing enclosures; this is most probably due to me giving it a fright or moving jerkily/too quickly. I have never seen a threat pose towards myself or food specimens either. They are truly slow to be angered.

The urticating bristles these tarantulas flick off are the MOST urticating type of any tarantula they can leave itching rashes on whichever body parts come into contact with them, which really can hurt sometimes. It is very important to avoid getting them in your airways, or eyes.

Fangs, though rarely threatened, are mechanically dangerous, in that they can be up to an inch long, and the power with which adults can inflict a bite is similar to that of a small cat. Fortunately for us all, they would rather flick hairs than bite, and probably not even that.

Before molt: I have noticed with all my T’s, that if they are getting close to a molt their behavior becomes unpredictable, non-burrowing specimens will burrow, calm specimens will become nervous and dart away from you etc etc. It IS a stressful time for them so be cautious and try AT ALL COSTS to avoid handling before a molt. Generally the specimen will go extremely dark black, will not be shiny and will have a bald patch. If you see all of these three signs a molt is VERY close by. With my L. parahybana the best sign a few weeks ahead of a molt is stopping feeding.

After molt: The L. parahybana is almost as white as paper and see through like a Perspex sheet for a short while after molting, eventually they become slightly grey and not transparent, then the grey becomes darker, you will also notice the pink hairs more easily, then eventually the grey becomes black. Throughout this hardening process the T won’t move much and you MUST NOT move it either. After 3-5 days I put in one small cricket and wait until the L. parahybana takes it then I know he is ready to feed again.

Notes:

I have seen my L. parahybana perched on the side of its container, although they are regarded as almost never climbing, they are not very good at it and he tends not to do it much. It is more of a ‘looking for a perch’ type of climbing he does. Keepers should aim to minimize injury potential by restricting the height of the enclosure.

68 comments:

  1. I saw a Lasiodora Parahybana Sling last week, dont really recognize it. But I hope to have sling.

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  2. Hello, be careful when you are buying sling's. When I bought mine most of them looked very similar and you would not be able to tell which species it was just by looks. When you want to buy one ask the place that is selling them to tell you the name of the species. All four of my T's were bought as sling's and all looked the same until they got bigger and more coloring. See if you can post a pic or pm me otherwise I can give you my email and some advice. :)

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    1. Show me some pictures of LP sling... What if it is already 1 inch? Can i already recognize it?

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  3. I'm a nervous new owner of a LP sling.Never thought I'd be so worried. It is so tiny and he stays hidden in a small notch I started in his substrate. He did eat two fruit flies and I have only had him for two days. Maybe I am over worrying and he is perfectly content in his little hole with a full belly.

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  4. Hi, you don't need to be nervous about them they're pretty good at looking after themselves. Does he move around? Or do you see him in different places of his enclosure? Have you seen him physically eating the flies or how do you know he is eating them? P.S with LP's you'll be shocked how much you can feed them, at adult stage (if you don't have issues with it) they can eat two adult mice a week...

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    1. I have a 4.8inch Female LP , how many hopper mice can I feed her?? can I feed her them often or you think there's a limit ?

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    2. Hi Achilles,

      You kind of need to gauge how much she wants to eat, I'd go for one hopper a week or every two weeks, some of my T's would eat two a week (different species), It depends on how hungry/greedy your one is, a good way to judge is if they haven't eaten/finished the food item (and may have ignored it) for about 30min then you should take it out of the tank.

      Kind regards,
      Gert

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  5. If I were to have the cobalt blue and the peocitheria miranda do you think I have enough experience

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  6. Yes definitely, the LP might seem as 'tame' as a curly hair if you're used to those two. ;) Most of the Lp's I've come across you can handle and they aren't too aggressive if you handle them often and from young. How long have you ahd those two? Ever been bitten or had the "threat pose"?

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  7. Ive had both of them for 3 years and I also have the rose hair curly hair and a metallic pink toe and I always wanted a very big tarantula but never a theat pose from either I also handled the cobalt no problem but I will not even try to handle the poke

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  8. I agree! The Cobalt can be handled, the Poke's are SOOO fast! I would not handle them due to being scared they "fly" off my hand and get injured! Although I love the Brazilian Pinktoe tarantulas and am going to buy one of them as soon as I find one with a nice size. Do you have photos of your tarantulas you would like posted here?

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    1. Cobalt can be handled are you nuts .. H.Lividum is one of the most defencive tarantulas in the world

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    2. Hi Anonymous, if you know how to handle them and do not scare them/make them feel defensive they can be handled. Please see this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CkSXdateyno

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    3. What is the purpose to handling them? The spider certainty doesn't want it. Ego? Daredevil mentality? The false belief you're "bonding"? No T wants to cuddle with you. The needs/wants of the T should be what matters. The T neither needs nor wants to be held. The fact you encourage it suggests you are not really responsible. Holding Ts is like holding your aquarium fish. But hey, if it feeds your ego....

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    4. Hi Anonymous,

      I'm sorry that you perceived it as an ego trip, we all have our own views and experiences after all. The reason I handle them often is so that it isn't a shock for them when I have to handle them (when they're struggling to get out of a moult, when I need to clean the tanks, if I need to take excess food out etc.) The last thing anyone would want in these times is a skittish T which may suffer more stress.

      Thankfully this world has a lot of different flavors of ice cream and we don't all have to love your favorite one or my favorite one.

      Keep well,
      Gert

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  9. Hello there, Im new to T's and have recently purchased a 4month old Brazilian Black, and a larger, maybe a year and half at 3.5" Salmon Pink. Shadow the Brazilian Black is doing great, molted twice and eating regularly. Apache my Salmon Pink on the other hand, has only eaten once, in four weeks I've had her. hides a lot, and is now not taking food at all. Even if I leave it in the tank awhile. she doesn't look like she is due a molt, but maybe I'm wrong?? She does seem quite skittish and darts at most noises.?? Any help would be awesome. Rob, UK.

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  10. Hi Rob

    That is very strange behavior for a Salmon Pink. Mine would readily flick bristles/raise its fangs at anything scurrying around in its tank when it wasn't eating. Are the bristles on the abdomen falling out? When she darts is it like a few steps or does she run and change directions a few times? :/ I try never buy already grown T's from people since you never know how they've been handled and if they're used to being handled or are scared/aggressive because of how they were treated. Do you plan on handling these?

    Kind regards
    Gert

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    1. Hey Gert, thanks for the rapid reply. she has a large pink area on her abdomen, I'm guessing from hair loss. she does flick a lot when I offer her food, and then turns and runs. on the odd occasion she will snap, but does not take to it. Ive had her a month now and had her out, although was not easy to get her out. she was good whilst out and even had my 5 year old hold her. but at the mo, just seems to hide and not taking to food. Yr thoughts please. thanks again. Rob

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    2. Hi Rob

      She is definitely moulting and will probably be done soon! The bald spot they develop is the first external sign we can see that shows this, the new exoskeleton is forming underneath the old one, so the bristles are no longer attached and fall off.

      Judging by the species and size of her, give it a month, small possibility of two months and she should pop out. :) All of the tarantulas I've ever kept get more defensive/skittish before and after moulting, they become very vulnerable at these times. So don't stress out.

      Put one cricket/worm in the tank, if she avoids it or runs away after a few minutes take it out to avoid causing stress on the animal, just ensure she has water and there is no mould in the tank (looks like small white spots of candy floss).

      I would love to see a photo of her, you can post it here or let me know and I'll give you an email address then I can post it for you. :) I'm considering getting more species, but wont rush it.

      Kind regards

      Gert

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    3. Hello, again this evening I've tried to feed, but still nothing. I'm guessing yr right, she must be due a molt. will keep tryin tho, just incase she is being fussy. had her out today, and she seemed fine, even let me stroke her on her abdomen, and even after I had put her back in tank, still managed to stroke her with no flicking. so maybe it's just getting used to New surrendering and all, Is my best guess. Will try to upload a photo of her if u tell me how too. lol. anyway, appreciate yr time.

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    4. Cool, I am glad she is used to being handled, those are the best T's! They aren't just ornaments any more lol.

      They don't do a complete personality change when molting (sorry for any misunderstanding) but they do become unpredictable. One day a good mood the next bad.

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    5. Had this problem and it was because it was too cold. Add heat and the T should eat again, if not molting.

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  11. hi..i have an 8 month old lp and i really to play with it a lot..just wondering how long will it take for molting to finish?

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    1. Hi Kirky

      It takes longer the larger the tarantula gets, remember this is a very tough process of detaching all muscles etc. from the outer exoskeleton (this is why the bristles fall off) and reattaching to the new soft one on the inside. I had an 8 month LP that took longer than 1 month to do this, the larger they get the longer it takes. Patience is the key with these pets. ;) It should have moulted by now already? Sorry for such a long delay on response, we moved house 600km away and struggled to get internet.

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  12. hi i have a l parahybana and somtime she is very agresive and trie to bite , and is started to hapend more often wath shoul i do?

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  13. Hi Mihai
    Are the bristles on her bum falling off? It could be that she is getting closer and closer to a moult, this is when they are more defensive because it is a very dangerous time for them (if they moult and there's a live cricket in the tank, their new exoskeleton is so soft a cricket will be able to chew it and potentially kill them). So they get very defensive at this time. How often do you feed it? Does her tank get moved around a lot/in an area with lots of noise/vibrations on the tank/table top?

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  14. Hy well i have to say that she got better i can take her in hands again . only like a day per week she became aggressive check on her every day for water or other things and i keep her in a corner were ar other animals like snake scorpion and some birds. But every animal in his own tank .and she usually eat like 2 bugs per week max size she can eat is ok? and there are some vibration from the sound devices but they are not so powerful.

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    1. Hello Mihai

      Apologies for the late reply! My LP was very greedy and would make a food ball of all the insects I put in (once it got to 8 before I stopped putting them in!). A good guideline is to put two or three in at once and check after 15min, the ones that aren't being eaten you can remove.

      Kind regards
      Gert

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  15. Hi. My spider has started spinning web all over his/her cage .... new behavior compared to previous years of ownership??? any comments or reasons??

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    1. Hi Susan

      Apologies for such a late reply, I have relocated recently and only now been able to get reliable Internet services! Usually a spider will spin web to lay a 'web mat' on the ground before molting, they will then flip upside down and molt on this so please don't remove it until that is done. l am sure the Tarantula is fine now?

      Kind regards
      Gert

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  16. Hi, I just got my baby(salmon pink) like two weeks ago. No complaints so far. Its about 2cm and very active. I'm a little worried about the bite that could hurt a bit.:)

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  17. hey Anonymous Sometimes is aggresive/defensive but not quick to bite, however, this species is considered somewhat 'handleable'. The fangs of adults and sub-adults are capable of medically significant mechanical damage.But depends of the character of your spider you'll se in time . I have a l.parahybana and somtime she is very agresive and trie to bite and parahybana usuali dont bite .

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  18. Hi, Kendyl here. I just got a sling by way of a reptile expo via a tarantula raffle. I have had a tarantula prior but lost her due to an issue of her tank not maintaining enough moisture while she was molting. :( Main concern with my lovely voracious eater of flightless fruit flies is a water/moisture source, since they are still in their condiment dish, what would you recommend? Any help would be appreciated since I just dealt with Avicularia Avicularia my lovely little arboreal. Thanks

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    1. Hi Kendyl

      Cute profile pic ;) If you have managed to read an Avic Avic then you should have no issues with the LP, they require much less humidity in the tanks. If you are concerned though, what I used to do with slings is use a small syringe and drop one or two drops of water on the ground. This will usually absorb quickly but will add enough humidity to the enclosure. A tarantula shouldn't ever have a water bowl which is wider than its legspan, I hope this helps?

      Kind regards
      Gert

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  19. Hi we have a spbe and she is about 8 months old. She has been through 3 molts and is the size of a large mex red knee now. How many crix should I be feeding her- she will eat as many and as often as I offer LOL. Also have you had any success feeding thawed pinkies? I can't bring myself to throw a live one in there, and I won't feed roaches. Any other insects you would recommend? Silk worms? She is also super skittish- this is the first tarantula I have owned who will not settle to be handled. Suggestions? Thank you for your help!!-Pam

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    1. Hi Pam

      My LP used to make a food ball with however many crickets I threw in at one time, but at that time I was power feeding her to grow as big as possible, she would run and kill all the crickets one at a time then collect them and drag them to a corner to be feasted on! I controlled the amount she are by feeding twice a week only not every day, she probably would have eaten everyday! I have read that you can give them a piece of steak and if you twitch it with a long thin piece of something keeping your hands away they can be trained to eat that. If she is skittish I don't know how well this will work... Roaches are great food but I've seen skittish tarantulas run from them, from beetles too. You can stick to crickets as they're great all round nutrition, silk worms are good for some variety and skittish T's. Meal worms are great food but you have to be careful with the big ones, they can bite very strongly so you might need to crush their heads. Pinkies only live ones, I was concerned that something thawed could have bacteria etc (just my own paranoia) but then you might have to wiggle it like the piece of steak. Maybe try a 'hopper/jumper' if the pinky seems too harsh?

      Kind regards
      Gert

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  20. Hi I just got my LP 4 days ago, it is 2.5" so my guess a little under a year old approx. these 4 days it hasn't left its hide! And hasn't Bin interested in feeding witch has me alittle concerned cuz everything iv read says their behavior is quite opposite. Although it was shipped to me from the other side of Canada so idk if it's just stressed from the 2 day trip and needs to get used to new environment idk? Any advice?
    Thanx jesse

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    1. Hi Jesse,

      Apologies for the delayed response, I have found with my T's once I clean their enclosures it takes them some time to figure out where things are and they explore a lot more than usual, but sometimes if they find their hides they just sit in them for a few days and only really explore at night. Please also keep in mind your T could be getting ready to moult, or the food items you're giving it may be too big, those are reasons in the past some of my T's have stayed in their hides for extended times, I hope all is well now?

      Kind regards,
      Gert

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  21. Hi Gert,
    I am new to keeping tarantulas and I just bought a 3.5 inch LP four days ago in Japan where I live. I transferred from the pet shop small container to a 20 gallon tank which I now realise is too big after looking at your site. The first day or two the LP was moving around the top of the cage and showed a couple of really quick bursts. She has never been on the ground since moving her and has been perched hi up on the tank side for over a day and won't move at all. The temperature is 24 degrees so I have fitted the heat mat yet and I haven't fed since receiving. I really hope she is not dead. Any advice at all would be much appreciated!
    Matt

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    1. Hi Matt,

      Do you have some kind of way to check the humidity in the tank? I've had T's "not want to walk on the ground" in the past as I made it too moist, once I'd changed that for something a bit more dry they were fine, you also need to make sure the substrate/ground matches their natural environment closely, what do you have on the bottom of the tank? Could you send me a photo?

      Kind regards,
      Gert

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  22. Hi there. My boyfriend (Matthaus) and I are new to the hobby and are very excited I got I got him a beautiful LP for his Birthday today... We were at a small pet shop and for the first time ever he was handling the LP and he said he fell in love with her immediately... So being new to this we just need as much advice as possible.... Could we send pictures to anyone as well... First question... we don't have exact measurments because we aren't to sure how to that just yet and as well because we have her in a temporary tank at the moment we just got her in and don't want to stress her out... so at about 4-5 inches could we have a determined age? Matthaus has already felt the great itch of the hairs, is there anything we could do to stop it or just wait it out? Has she started the molting process? (will send pictures) how should we handle her to not stress her out? How often? Chances of her biting and warning signs? are gloves safe to use? The pet shop owner wasn't very helpful or talkative at all so we just decided to tackle this head on... I apologize if this was strung out but we just want the absolute best for her and we would like to see her live for as long as possible...

    Thanks so much for anyone willing to help.
    Jess and Matthaus

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  23. Hi Jess,

    Wow there's a lot to answer there! It is going to be tricky to determine age based on size, using information in this book http://www.takealot.com/the-tarantula-keeper-s-guide/PLID35198676?gclid=CjwKEAjw8NaxBRDhiafR-uvkpywSJAAxcl6f_YC0ZBV4JhB7CEzJYDRbqO-dLLr3LgnmTfDJpoBl1RoCSXLw_wcB we could hazard a guess, but there are a lot of factors that affect how large the T can get and how quickly they grow. A VERY rough guess is that The LP specifically could be about 1year old when at 6inches legspan.

    The best way to make the itch of the bristles go away is to use some kind of sticky tape, stick it on the itchy areas then pull it off, that could help remove the bristles. It's unfortunately something you can't stop (as it's one of their evolved defence mechanisms) and the severity differs from person to person and tarantula to tarantula.

    Handling T's is a controversial matter for some people: some detest it others love it, please keep in mind it isn't necessary for the T's survival to be handled, it is more for our benefit (makes it easier to clean/change enclosures/not stress the T out if the enclosure is moved around often -though try avoid that). I used to handle mine once a week (though not when they're getting ready to moult or busy in a moult or just after one) and it was a pleasure to clean their enclosures (you only really need to do this once every 6-12 months, I did it every 6 months or when necessary - mite infestation etc). Gloves are safe to use as long as they don't have a ton of chemicals/powders etc. on them.

    Generally speaking the fist warning sign will be flicking the bristles from it's abdomen with the back legs, the second warning will be "standing back up" on the back four legs with the front four raised up and fangs bared, the third warning could be a bite.

    When picking up my T's I used a method that isn't the best recommended one, though I have luckily never had issues with it. I found that with my specific T's if I gently stroked the back of their abdomen (in the direction of the bristles not against it) then I could coax them to move forward onto my hand. Whenever i accidentally touched a back leg they got a fright and ran forward a short bit (hence why this isn't a good idea, they could run off your hand, fall on the floor and get injured). These two videos may be helpful: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7oR7PKYVr0Y and https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CDzR9upnPw I pretty much always gently push their 'bum' and have not had issues.

    Sorry for the delayed response, you can mail me on thesquoggle@gmail.com.

    Kind regards,
    Gert

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  24. I bought this LP of mine 3 days past (1inch).does it have special conditions on how to care for it?

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    1. Hi Unknown, How do you mean special conditions? Because of its size etc? Only one really is if you add a water bowl always make sure it's a smaller size than the legspan of the tarantula, so that if it falls in it can climb out. Hope this helps?

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  25. This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

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  26. Your tarantula generally gets what it needs from its prey, but you can place a very shallow container with a little water.

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    1. Thanks for assisting Kendyl :) Sherlock check my reply 1 or 2 comments higher up about water container size if you're curious about the size. :)

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    2. Can I ask the life span of an LP for both gender thanks

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    3. Hi! Females reported to live 15-20 years, occasionally more. Males live much shorter lives, reaching maturity as quickly as two years. This is what I found on a bunch of different websites, I've only had my female for 4 years the male passed away last year at about 2-3 years age.

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  27. Can I ask for the life span of an lp for both gender

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    1. Hi! Females reported to live 15-20 years, occasionally more. Males live much shorter lives, reaching maturity as quickly as two years. This is what I found on a bunch of different websites, I've only had my female for 4 years the male passed away last year at about 2-3 years age.

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  28. I've had my female for 18yrs she has just shed and still going strong she is 8 inches. And I've never held her once

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    1. Good for you Shaun! I'm glad she's lived so long and got to such a large size, they're a wonderful species!

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  29. Wow, that lady is all about the bass.. ;)

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  30. I have had my bird eater 3 days I'm new at is in scared out my skin to even approach it how do i start or best way to handle it. And setting up his tank what should be in their

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    1. There are a few ways, some I wasn’t brave enough to try because I’m clumsy and was worried I’d hurt them. So the easiest for me was put my hand in front of it, gently touch its ‘bum’ with a paint brush. And healthy slowly edge it forward. When I touched the legs they got a fright and ran very fast. When they didn’t want to interact they’d flick bristles off their bum at me so I left them alone for the day.

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  31. Are there any more large tarantulas that can be safely handled

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    1. I believe most of them can be safely handled, as you have to clean their enclosures so there’s always some kind of handling involved. Just don’t have them very high off the ground, slow or fast if they get a fright and run or jump off your shoulder could get injured.

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  32. I have a salmon pink spiderling whose color went dark as if he is prepping for a shed. He wont eat and is webbing his home up a little. Im not sure if im to expect a shed or that he will be dead, he is being so weird

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    1. your spiderling is getting ready to moult

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  33. They usually do lay a web to molt, not when they’re going to die. They don’t know this much. ;) The ones ive has that passed was kind of sudden. They basically die standing up, if he’s on his back then he’s molting so don’t disturb him. I hope that helps?

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  34. My sling is being highly inactive. It molted a week ago and still refuses to eat. Is this normal?

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  35. Nvm lol. Turns out he just isnt as active as i thought. I killed a cricket And set it in his cage. After a couple of hours i came back and found him eating. I still need to up the oxygen level in the trailer.

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  36. hi. love your caresheet. my lp is one year old now. i have started feeding it smallish locusts. the lp always seems hungry since last moult. how many locusts do you think i should feed it at this age?

    many thanks

    andy bunn

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  37. hi all. Del Toro my male Lasiodora parahybana has not eaten since December 2018. His last meal was a large locust.

    i have offered him other food types as he can be fussy. Still he has not eaten. He is showing all the signs of being in premoult but four months seems a very long time. Any one else experienced this?

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  38. Hiya. New to tarantulas. I have an adult female my partner bought 6 weeks ago. She hasn't feed since we bought he . Is this normal?

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